Career Path: Fashion Industry | Guests: Alison Bruhn & Delia Folk, Founders of The Style That Binds Us

Join me as we dive into the fashion industry when I speak with the mother-daughter dynamic duo, Alison Bruhn and Delia Folk, co-founders of The Style That Binds Us, a next-gen media company focused on style and fashion.
Hear about each of their unconventional entrees into the world of fashion and the relationships and skills they developed. Delia shares how she got her first opportunity with an internship at Versace and her first role upon graduation at Barneys New York on the buying team.  After studying at the Fashion Institute of Technology, Alison became a national style and image consultant.  Alison and Delia talk about what helped them become successful in the competitive fashion world and how their media company The Style That Binds Us is connecting their shared love of fashion and culture with their audience.

Don't miss this episode if you're looking to work in the fashion industry  - or, just love fashion and style!

Additional Show Notes and Links:

Click here to DOWNLOAD the Core Wardrobe Checklist

A few retailers to check out when building your core wardrobe:
J. Crew
M.M. LaFleur
Ralph Lauren
Ann Taylor
Poshmark

Article on the science behind dressing and how we're perceived and how we perform:  Research Shows That the Clothes You Wear Ac

LAUNCH Career Strategies was founded by Karen Elders and Elyse Spalding. We help young professionals launch a successful career path with expert coaching services. Reach out today for an initial FREE coaching session.
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Transcript

Are you looking for your first internship or job or maybe the next step in your career? Welcome to Top of the Pile, the podcast explores all things career for 20-somethings. I'm Karen Elders with Launch Career Strategies and I'll be your host. Let's get started. Welcome back to Top of the Pile. We're really shifting gears today and I'm excited to mix it up a little bit and move over to the fashion industry. My guests today are the mother-daughter power team of Alison Bruhn and Delia Folk. They both have had very successful careers in fashion, although different areas and starting out at different points. And they brought their talents together to create the Style That Binds Us, which is a media company and community that focuses on fashion and culture. And, but really I feel like they're finding and helping women. find and present their own style. So I'm really excited to have you. So welcome, Allison and Delia. The real to be here. Awesome, awesome. Okay, so starting out, you know, in the career kind of space. So we'll start with you, Delia. You attended William & Mary College in Virginia, which is the top liberal arts college. Tell us a little bit about, you know, what was your major and what sparked your interest to- focus on the fashion industry. So I majored in marketing. I ended up doing that. So at William & Mary, you have to apply to the business school and then you don't just major in business generally, you choose a focus. And so basically what happened was, I first went to Alabama, it was like 13th grade, very safe and comfortable and all of that. And then I came to the realization that college should be a time to go out and meet new people and experience new things. Why continue just having the same life that you've always had? And so I left and went to William & Mary. So then that was the first time that I was surrounded by ambitious women, which is what I talked to you about. And that was so fascinating to me and it completely changed my life, I guess. So basically then I had to come up with a major. And so I decided somehow I'm gonna move to New York and work in the US. in fashion, William & Mary, as you said, liberal arts. And so there was nothing to do with fashion there. And so I thought, okay, well, why don't I pursue business? Because that will be a good thing to do that knowledge to have, I can apply that to anything. And also since we started our own business, it was very helpful. So that that's what I did. So then I entered Versace and worked at Barneys, New York on the buying team. Okay, so interesting. So marketing and business, obviously very good foundations to go into a number of career paths. And so tell us about, you know, so your first role going back to that internship at Versace, how did you get that? You know, you're down in Virginia, you're not in a school in New York City, which you're not at a fashion school. How did you find out about the Versace internship? And if you remember, and how did, you know, what did you focus on when you're at that internship? What kind of department are you in? And maybe you can speak to this, like, from what I understand, and I'm jumping ahead a little bit, but. there seem to be two main routes in fashion, right? There's sort of that design creative side and manufacturing the clothes. And then there's the more I call it business side of buying and merchandising and marketing PR for the brand or the retailer. So maybe let us know about your internship and what you worked on and maybe what area that's correct in business you worked on. Yes, definitely. So when I decided this, then Of course, the family's talking all about it. And so my aunt, her best friend from college, husband, worked at Versace. So then she's like, oh, well, y'all could talk to him to help Delia figure out, does she wanna pursue a career in fashion? And if so, how should she go about that? Came up here to New York, sophomore, spring break, and met with him. And so he detailed, if you wanna work in fashion, these are all the things that you should do. I'm not gonna give you an internship. You need to work for it. You need to apply to. all these other places as well and all of this. So basically that was a great starting point for me. I'm very type A, so I followed all of those steps and that's basically a bunch of networking. So one thing I think you're gonna ask me a little bit later, but basically when you're working in fashion, you need to decide on the level of luxury and you can't go below that. So for example, like a Barney's Bergdorf, they're not necessarily and maybe today they would, but they're not gonna really play with the Macy's TJ Maxx. They can, they can be open to that, but if you do wanna work in luxury, I would highly recommend starting in luxury because you could later go to a TJ Maxx or something, but if you wanted to do the reverse, that might be a little bit more challenging. And so basically you have your list. So I went through a magazine and I put together, cause sometimes it's hard to come up on command, like what company do you wanna work for? Come up with all the fashion companies that exist. that you would want to work for or like mom and I did walk up and down Madison Avenue and drop off your resume. But so you put together the list and then on LinkedIn advanced search, then you put in Bergdorf's Louis Vuitton, you know, all of these things. And then you connect with people at those companies. And then once they connect with you, then you have your message that you send. Hey, I'm Delia Folk. I'm a junior at the College of William & Mary. I want to work in fashion and I would love to have a coffee with you or would you be willing to speak to me over the phone? I'd love to hear about your career. pros and cons of your job. You know, you have your list of questions so you can really get an understanding. Like me coming from Alabama, I didn't hardly know, I didn't know anyone who worked in fashion or anything about it. Like you're saying, there's these two verticals, but there's so many different potential positions. How are you to know which is you're going to enjoy, which is right for you? So that is a great way to do that. One, to have these connections in the company to really understand and learn about their role. And then you can try to figure out is, would that be something that would work? well for you. And what's great about internships, you should really have multiple if possible because sometimes it's hard to know until you get there. And so then being able to do that in an internship situation, figure out what you like and more importantly, maybe what you don't like. It's much harder once you started in a job. If you are working in marketing or if you're working on the buying team, it would be very hard for you to move to Vogue and editorial. So it would be a challenge to change that up once you're actually in the job, but maybe you would be willing to start over and sometimes that's totally fine. So what I did was I worked in wholesale. And so basically what that is, is it was the flip side of the buying team. So Donatella Versace and the design team, they designed the collection a year in advance. And then at the six month mark, that's when it's market. So I was starting in the summer. And so. all the buyers from around the country and the world would come to meet with us. We would show them the collection and then together we would decide the pieces that they were going to select for each store and online in six months. Got it. Okay, interesting. So you were on the retail or the brand side selling the line of you know, helping to promote and sell the collection for the buyers to pick. And then you work with them obviously on what their goals are and everything and what they're going to put an order in for, correct? And something that they wanted in Miami would be completely different than the selection they would pick for New York, for example. That makes sense, that makes sense. Okay, so interesting. And I also love that you did mention how you networked so specifically because, you know, LinkedIn... is such a, the backbone of networking really. And it's the foundation, but, you know, I wasn't sure if you'd say that the fashion industry used it because, but if anything, it can just be a great resource for learning about companies. But the fact that you went out and laid those networking, that groundwork of making the connections. And I think the biggest thing that you said that is so important is that you were reaching out and asking people, to talk about their career and what worked and for you to learn versus I need a job. I want you to help me get a job. Like it's a building block. After you develop a relationship over maybe a number of conversations, you can then say, you know what? There's an opening at X company. I know you have a connection or within your own company. Would you be willing to refer me, et cetera? You have to build to that point. So I think that's a good reminder to anybody listening is that it's, it's never too early to start that process because you have to build it up over time. Absolutely. I think the week, the first week you started in the business school, one of her professors asks, um, raise your hand if you have 500 connections on LinkedIn and anyone that didn't raise their hand, which was most of the people, he said, you're, you're way behind already. So this was sophomore year or junior year. He already, you know, was telling people you need at least 500 connections already. And I had a lot of clients, they were out of college and they still hadn't started working on LinkedIn. So if you have all those connections already, then when you're ready for, you know, looking for your first job, then you can send out these mass emails to all the connections you've made on LinkedIn and everywhere else and explain that you're looking for a job in the city. And, you know, then people start emailing you back and, you know, oh, I have a friend. who's leaving to go back to graduate school. So why don't you apply for their position at so-and-so and that's, you're on the inside track. Yeah, exactly. And one of the, I think I always say this, but LinkedIn is quantity and quality. So there's a value to the quantity and obviously a value to the quality, but the quantity factor is just numbers because when someone goes and looks, an HR person or anyone looks at your LinkedIn profile and they see, oh, We have three common connections or 20 or one, whatever the number is. You're more likely to have those common connections with the volume of connections you have. So you don't wanna just connect with anybody. I'm not saying that. What? You have to go quality. But in those early days of college, don't think of it as Facebook where it's weird. Like I don't know that person. I only know them from class. Well, that's good enough for LinkedIn in my life. If you're in a class with them, You know their name, you're familiar with them. You respect them in some way, reach out to them, connect with them. So that's great. Okay, so I love hearing about that internship. And then, so Allison, switching over to you, Delia's successful career, what I understand, awoke something in you and your love of fashion and style. So tell us a little bit about how you started your career in the industry and how it led to the style that binds us. I took classes at FIT. They have an image consulting program, you know, as an adult and in the South, in my generation, paying too much attention to your own looks was frowned upon, it was thought of as vain, but at the same time, you learned that you needed to have a visual brand basically in a quiet way. You needed to have a certain look, you know, and that kind of thing. So you've got a lot of mixed messages, I finally realized that more than just playing with fashion and having fun, you can use what you put on your body as a resource. It's a way to control the narrative about what people think of when they see you. So at FIT, they teach you about the science behind getting dressed. The brain of the person that's looking at you is assigning attributes to you. And That's not judging, that's just the way our brains work. They're searching for similar patterns and things. So you can either sabotage yourself or you can control the narrative about what they're probably thinking about you, depending on how you're presenting yourself to the people. So especially if you're going on an interview and things like that, those kinds of things are super important and they're tools that you have in your toolbox that can help you get the interview over someone else, even before you open your mouth. Well, and especially if you're interviewing in the fashion industry, I would think that, your style and the brand you're putting forward is critical, right? Oh, sure, sure. And I don't, we work less with people that wanna be in the fashion industry than we work with people who have just graduated from law school or they just got in their MBA or they're moving to New York and they majored in art history and they're working in a gallery and they need to be able to take these wealthy clients to dinner, but they don't have a lot of money and they have small closets and how do they create sort of a uniform look where they can, the people that see them say, oh yes, she deserves a seat at our table kind of thing. This, these subliminal messages, you know, how to create. Also, when you go on an interview, if the person who's interviewing you immediately thinks, I can see her in our company. I can see him in our company. He would be a great face for the brand. You know, yes, we would want him to go out and be client facing or have public speaking events and things like that. You know, it's interesting. There's a couple things there. Number one, Delia, when we spoke, you mentioned that there's real data on how what we wear affects how well we work. So. Can we jump to that for a second? Can you talk about that theory for a minute? Well, there are two parts to that. One part is what you're wearing sends messages to your brain. So if you are even, you know, if you're doing a Zoom call even without the video on, if you are super comfortable, you are sending a message to your brain that it's cozy time, that, ooh, I'd like to have a nap. You know, you just feel so soft and cozy. But if you are dressed in a more tailored way, you're gonna sit up straighter, you're gonna feel like you're more in a position of power and your brain immediately gets this message, oh, it's work time, it's time to be serious, it's time to pay attention. So that's one way that it works within yourself. The other thing is it works for the people that you meet with. So like, if you go to a doctor's office and you're sitting in the examining room waiting for someone to come, and someone walks in a lab coat, immediately your brain thinks, okay, here's the doctor, here's the expert. But if that person came in and something super casual, you would not think that this was the doctor or the PA or anyone in a position of authority. So we know that's an example of assumptions that we make based on what people are wearing. And then the same thing goes for another study that showcases this in clothes cognition. There were two men that they dressed in the same suit off the rack. It was a gray suit. They were the same age. They had their hair cut the same way. One of them, they had him get the suit tailored. So it fit to his body like a bespoke suit, but it was the same suit off the rack. Both men went on interviews at the same places at different times. And invariably the man with the tailored suit got the job. But when That's not that surprising. But when they asked the people during the interviewing why they chose that person, they would say they had assigned attributes to him like, well, you can tell he's super organized. He looks like the people that work in our business. We want him to be client facing. He's smart, he's intelligent, and he's well organized just simply because he had his suit tailored. And so those are the kind of like, you know, these little tools you have in your toolbox, plus the fact that you feel like a million bucks when your clothes, you know, you don't fly somewhere for an interview and take out a crumple suit and your hair's still wet and you run to the interview and you're kind of scattered, you know, this way you're super organized, you go in there, you have a lot of self-confidence, and then you are already ready to nail the interview as you walk in the door. Absolutely. And you know what? It's so interesting because It's an example or examples of how many different things are going on outside of what you say in an interview. Oh, yes. Yes. How you answer a question, your confidence, what how you're showing up as you say, you know, and I mean, I say it from and just to add to that is like, you know, how you show up in the minute you walk into the building. Let's say it's an in-person interview. you know, how you interact with the security guard, to the receptionist, to smiling in the elevator to the person you didn't realize was the CEO. So if it's virtual, you're the first one, or maybe definitely a little early, onto the Zoom. You know, how's your light? Are you looking down at the camera? I mean, the laptop or whatever instead of eye level, which is very awkward for both of you. So it's all those things. and how are you dressing? Are you showing up? Do you care? Does it show whether you care or not? And that's really, I think, kind of what it comes down to. So that's an interesting example. Yeah, it's called, you know, it's how you do anything is how you do everything. So a lot of my wardrobe consulting clients, I will say, once we get the look together, I'll say, what's the coat? You know, and they're like, well, that didn't matter because I'm just going to take it off when I get there. Or the bag, especially if it's a nighttime event. Well, it didn't matter, I'm just going to put it down somewhere. I'm like, no. your entrance and your exit are huge. You know, think of it as you're walking in, you're walking on stage basically. And it's the same thing with the interview, that first look when you walk in the door, you know, for example, let's say you are someone like a day on the buying team after a while, you pretty much know when the person walks into the interview whether the powers that be are gonna pick the line up. or you can already tell the mistakes just by the presence that they have when they walk in the room. And it's the same thing with any kind of interview. What are they looking for? And then, you know, mimic that in your own style, of course, and for your own body type. But that's when I get into the part about, if you are really serious about the interview, if you can go sit outside the building, see what the people look like when they're coming and going. You know, look online, research the... company, local, see if they have an Instagram account, a Facebook account, anything where you can see what the people are wearing. And even if it is a casual look, create, create that in a way that's still super polished so that you do stand apart in a positive way, not in a negative way. There are ways that you can stand apart from the group wearing very simple clothing. Yeah. And those are all great points. And I think important. I'm sure people are hearing this the right way, but like it's not, it's not about spending more money or, you know, it's really just about polish and respect and things like that. But also I think it's interesting you just said that because it is really important to learn about how the culture of a company, which is how they dress, you know, is part of the culture. Is it a tech company that's super casual and everybody's in ripped jeans? Well, they're okay, but there's a way to add some polish to that. And then you can adjust your fashion as you move within the company, but you may find that you wanna have your own style and say, you know, I'd like to get a little, I'd like to up this game a little bit. So we were talking about how a lot of the tech spaces is just the nature of the way people are working in that space, but it doesn't mean you have to. completely copy that you can polish it up a bit and maybe stand out that way. I think it's an opportunity to stand out for sure. Absolutely. And being super casual does not mean messy hair. You know, if you're a woman, absolutely no makeup, you know, you can do a very, very subtle, everything can be very simple and it doesn't cost money. It's just taking an extra five minutes before you walk out the door to put yourself together. to make sure that, you know, especially if it's for an interview, your clothes are ironed or, you know, steamed. That's such an easy thing to do. You're not wearing too much makeup. You're not wearing anything that is distracting. And it really does depend on the industry too, you know, especially like in finance or law and things like that. That's when I'm talking about having this power in your toolbox to walk in there and be taken seriously. Anytime you wear something with a cut, like a collared shirt or a blazer, anything that has angles in it, what the brain of the person looking at you is thinking, that person has something to tell me. How can I best show up so the person that I'm meeting with gets value out of me? On that note, I know we talked about how to have, or the importance, sorry, of having a core wardrobe robe. Can you give me a sense of what that means? And obviously to what you just said, there are different wardrobes in general for different industries, but as far as finance, advertising, tech, real estate, is there a common core wardrobe? There really is. And we have a core wardrobe printable checklist on the website that they can print out and you can check off what you have and circle what you don't have and things like that, but you need to know your body type so you can get the right things. really across the board for men and women, it's similar. For women, you add in like a silk cami and things like that. But if you think about any wardrobe, the basic tops, you need like, if you have a silk cami, not something really tight and fitted that you wear under clothes, but something that you could wear under anything from a beautiful scarf to go out at night to a blazer for work, to a jean jacket to buy itself. with a pair of jeans, you know, it can go across all levels. So when you have these under the first layer, let's say you're, it's like, think of it as a painting. You have a canvas. So you have the white silk cami, the white t-shirt, the white sleeveless turtleneck, the white button down, oversized or whatever it is. Then you move on to black. You have the same thing in black. You have a basic black pant. You have a blaze. And then you do the same thing with like a neutral. And it, you know, neutral, especially for summer, you know, you do the white jeans instead of maybe the blue jean and the black jean. And then you would have a khaki pair of pants, too. You would have a basic black dress that you can wear, you know, everybody wants like a funeral dress, same thing with a man, a formal one formal suit, you know, one look that you can always know is there, but also you can mix and match it to a lot of other things. But if you have this very small group of clothes, in one darker set and one lighter set. And then you have the same shoes and bags, both like for the shoes and bags, a dressier version and then a very casual version of both. Then you can create all these different looks. Like if you get a really simple black dress, you can wear it with a sneaker and a blue jean jacket for coffee on the weekend, or you can dress it up by itself with a pump or a high heel strappy sandal a little clutch and a sparkly earring for night. So these pieces are boring to look for, but they are literally the hero pieces of your closet. You're gonna wear them all the time. And what happens in the process is all those jackets that you love that popped out at you off of Instagram and things like that, that you got home and you couldn't figure out what in the world, how to put them together, you'll have that in your core wardrobe. You're like, oh, I can stick this cami under it. and my blue jean, or I can also put it with this little black cropped pant and a heel to go out at night. All that stuff is already in your closet. And it is, you have to think of those pieces as an investment. That does not mean spending a lot of money, but it does mean making sure it's good enough quality that it's going to be able to hang in there with you because you're going to be wearing it on repeat. Another thing to look for is, is it dry clean only? Is it 100% cotton? So it has to be ironed. especially younger people, well, really all ages now, are you willing to take the clothes to the dry cleaner? Are you willing to take the time to iron the pieces? If you're not, then find brands that make clothes that have wrinkle-free versions, fabrics and things like that. So this part takes time. It's not super exciting, but it is the basic, it is the canvas for your artwork. I absolutely love the way you just broke that down because for me, I'm not, I don't know, the biggest fashionista in general, but this is why it's such an interesting topic to me personally, but I think that's really helpful for people to hear, like kind of going through that simple way of call it white, black, neutral, like those three main buckets. getting all those pieces and then like you say, the fun, I make the mistake of buying too much of the fun Instagram thing and then I don't have anything to go with it and it sits there. Very normal behavior. You know, they do that on purpose. It pops off, you know, grabs you. You feel passionate about it. You're not gonna feel passionate necessarily about a white blouse, but there's so many different white button downs for men and women. You have to know your body type or you're gonna get four almost white shirts, but you're not gonna have that one. works for you and that's what I'm talking about boring and time consuming. The other thing is if it's something like a trench if you're in finance or something or you know you're working in a big city a trench is a great piece because it can be worn the majority of the year except for in the coldest of months and you don't have to buy a two thousand dollar robbery trench but you can also you want it to last maybe even for years so shop consignment you know look for sales there are all kinds of things and also you just have it on the list. like I'm gonna see this one day at a consignment shop or something and it's gonna be my size and I'll finally get it off my wish list, that kind of thing. But it's the same thing for men. So a young guy coming out of college, he's like, I don't think I need a stylist, you know? But so it's not even the right term. It's more like, you know, a wardrobe consultant, just like you would consult with anyone else. This is gonna be my life now. What can I take with me from college? And what do I need to do to up the game a little bit so people take me seriously? You know, these life change times, you're an empty nester, you're going back to work. You're retiring, you don't need all the more dressy things in your closet. It's usually those times in life when you're about to make a big change that you need to reevaluate your wardrobe as well. So when you show up at the job, let's say you're transferring from New York to Miami, the first day at work at your new job, you're not showing up, you know, in your New York clothes down in Miami, and it's an instant sign to everyone, oh, that she's an amateur. You know what I'm saying? Or you're moving up the ladder and the first day when you have that first meeting with your new group, you wanna look the part. You wanna look important and serious and relevant. The other thing that's interesting right now about what's happening with everybody trying to figure out this new normal for work wear, going kind of moving from super casual back to somewhere in the middle. I had a woman, so someone will come to me like, this is a woman, she's been a partner at a law firm for years, and she just made managing partner. She's the only female at that level. And she wanted to elevate her wardrobe a little bit to mirror that. But her team was going to meet with someone in the music industry, and this was post COVID. I'd say this was a couple months ago. And they decided because the person was in the music industry, that they would go with a more casual look. So the team get went to meet them with the man and the feedback they got was, I thought lawyers wore suits. So he thought they didn't care enough about him to put on their, you know, to, to dress up enough, to, to look the part of what a lawyer is supposed to look like. So she was going to be saying, okay, I need some suits. I need some suits that I can also wear the blazer with a gene. that I can also wear the pant with just like a sweater or some kind of little printed blouse and a loafer or something too. Are there any stores, retailers, you know, brick and mortar or online that you would recommend? I mean, I do use Poshmark and I will, I think that's a great place. For example, if you really had your heart set on a Burberry trench, that's a great place to find it because you can really specifically look for that. Are there any other places, it doesn't have to be, you know, used clothing, but like any place online that you find for like a young professional to go find things that is affordable? Well, the deal with that too is, it depends on where you're going to work and what your own style aesthetic is, because J.Crew has a new men's director and I think they're doing a great job of sort of business smart, casual and suiting. And then the same thing for women. And then also, M.M. Lafleur, who we work with a lot. And she realized as a woman in the money world, she couldn't find anything to wear. So she actually left that world and created a brand that is specifically for work wear. It's only for women at this point though. But that's a good one. Anne Taylor, I know it's been around forever, and they don't do men's either. But I think that's great for women because they have. Petites, they have larger sizes. They try really hard. They have the curvy fit, the straight fit. They try really hard to fit every woman. And then for guys, Ralph Lauren is still a thing and there's outlet stores. And I think a lot of guys do consignment too, especially if you live in a bigger city, go spend a Saturday and go around to the actual consignment stores. Another thing you can do when you do that in person, is say, I'm looking for blank. If you all get one in, in this side, will you make a note? Will you call me? Right, that's a good point. Yeah, yeah. But what happens because people don't wanna spend the time is they buy a bunch of almost and it crowds their closet and they still don't wanna put it on to important things. And so when I get there to work with them, they have a closet full of stuff in there like I have nothing to wear here. They're very frustrated. And I say, show me your basic white shirt. Well, does this count? Does this count? They keep lifting up. You know, this one has ruffles. This one has cutouts. This one has something on the back, you know? They're like, well, I could cover the fact that it's really low in the back up with a blazer at work. What if you get hot at work? You know, I mean, you know, that's your, that skirt's a little short when you sit down, you know, things that... that people, if they just take a little more time, they can knock it out of the park. They truly can. Well, I love that back to the checklist that you have. So I'm gonna definitely leave a link to your checklist and obviously your website, everything like that. And you know, so I love all of this advice and my, I'm jumping a bit back, but Delia, you know, with all of this, if we... If we go back to the idea of going into the business, going into fashion as an industry, not just what to wear, but like, let's say you want to go into the fashion. Any other advice you can give for young people considering a career in fashion? And, you know, are there networking groups to join or any other tips that you have to offer? Yes, for sure. And also to remember, I mean, yes, at Barney's, at And in fashion, many, many people come from Parsons and FIT, but that certainly is not required. And you are going to bring a lot to the table if you didn't major in something that has to do with fashion. So it's all about how you pitch yourself. And one thing we were talking about earlier, nonverbal communication is like 55 plus percent. What you say is the least important. What you say is important, but how you look in the interview. is beyond, that's the most important thing. And then your resume and then all of those things. Yes, I majored in marketing, I majored in business. I am so excited to learn. I am working here for the greater good of this company. It's not, what can you do for me? Hey, can I pick your brain? You know, all of these need to be mutually beneficial. And so you need to come in there and be taught knowing about what's happening with the company and coming potentially with ideas, not too much but just a little bit. And you. took retail math at FIT, right? Any of that was after I started at Barneys. Right, I'm saying if you didn't go to FIT, if you didn't major in fashion retailing or merchandising or anything like that, you can take some courses like that. And the other thing that Dalia did that I was impressed with while she was there, she would make appointments with the people in roles above her. And when she went to meet with the CEO of Barneys, The woman said, I thought you were coming to tell me that you wanted to quit. And she said, no, I wanted to learn about you. I wanted to know about your career, how you got here. You know, what are the things that you think are important for someone moving up the ladder and everything? And that was impressive to them. It's internal networking is so overlooked. It's so something that it's easy to get stuck in your little bubble at your office and interact with the people in your immediate group or surroundings and not... you know, be like, oh, I'm gonna bother that person in the next department, but you will be so much more valuable at your job to get a broader understanding of what other people do, how their role, it all supports the company goals. But I love that, that's fabulous. It's really, really a smart, smart move. I think it depends on how badly you want to achieve things. You know, if you go somewhere, the idea that came out of the quiet quitting, I worried about the people that decided that was the route to go because I knew eventually what was going to happen to them in the end. You know, they wouldn't advance. They wouldn't achieve great things because they were telling themselves, you know, I'm just going to do the least I can because I want to have a quality of life. But eventually if you, you know, probably need money to have a quality of life and things like that. So those type things where Delia was always the first to get there. She was very good friends with the security guards and things like that. She always stayed till after her boss left. Sometimes she'd be texting me, oh, I don't know when she's ever gonna leave. But she did and everyone on her team knew one time there was gonna be a. The snowmageddon was coming to New York City and everyone was like, oh good, we'll get a snow day. But they were laughing. They were like, day is gonna make us all look bad because she's gonna trudge through the snow and show up at work because that's her mentality. But that's what moved her up. Yeah, make you memorable. Show up, just show up. At this point in the business world, I mean, the finance world for the most part has moved back into the office every day. But... there's many industries that have not. And I do think just showing up, even if you don't have a required number of days, just at least one or two days a week to try to show your face. So what have we missed? Anything else? What's next for the style that binds us? I mean, you guys have so much going on with your styling and your media and your own podcasts and community. What, anything new to share on that front? Well, Most recently we have styling services for students. So mom has, as a stylist, she has worked with all of these different types of people, but now we've just kind of split them up into sections so that people are more aware. So the latest one that we did was styling services for students. So that's where creating interview attire and then what you're gonna wear to interviews, and then also early career wardrobe. So that would be a phenomenal gift if a grandmother, mother, whatever is looking to for a graduation gift, that would be a great option to set their, whoever it is that they're gifting up for style success in their career because the whole thing is we want you to wear the clothes, be super confident. You don't necessarily have to have the skills. You can outsource this. You don't have to spend all the time. Mom can help you and put together all the things and then you can go to work. You can achieve all of your personal professional goals without having to be distracted by your outfit or pulling it down. We answer all of those questions to make getting dressed less stressful and much easier each day. So that's something and then- It's really a gift for the parents too, especially the moms. Everything they show the child. I remember Dillie was like, I'm not getting a black suit. Why would I ever need a black blazer? This was in college. You know, like, well, you have to have at least a black dress, something to go on an interview. You know, it's exasperating for parents. So you can turn that over to someone else. Exactly. I love that. That's terrific. That's terrific. I'll include that in the link as well. I mean, there's so much to say. We're doing our mini mag is exciting. It's basically a snapshot of what you know for each month. The new... books that are coming out, new songs, new shows to watch. And we do interviews with artists and designers and all kinds of things. That is really something that is our gift to you. And you can read it in increments and things like that. Hopefully it's a really fun thing to discover. So we are always here for whatever it is that you need, any questions that you have. We want you to live your most stylish and fearless life. That's fabulous. And I will, you know, obviously connect all these links into the... into the podcast show notes and you guys are fabulous. I love it. And I think you're such a great combination of energy and everything. So thank you so much for doing this today. I really appreciate it. Oh, my gosh. Yes. Thank you for having us. We loved it. Launch Career Strategies helps young professionals launching a successful and fulfilling career path. Check us out at LaunchCareerStrategies.com. By the way, if you enjoyed this podcast, please leave a rating. Reviews are key to helping spread the word about Top of the Pile, so it can reach other young professionals or anyone looking for advice on how to up their career game. Thanks for listening. I hope you have, or are having, an awesome week.